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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 13:19 
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So I've been following this gamergate thing for almost 2 months now and it's been an eventful ride. For those of you who haven't, it really took off with the ex of a female game developer writing a post about emotional abuse, and that said game developer Zoe Quinn had been sleeping with five prominent figures in the indie game scene. Some of which have supported or promoted her or her game at some point in time. Since then a lot of curruption and nepotism has been revealed like rigged contests and journalists with social or financial ties to the games they're promoting on their sites.

I can assume that most of us here at SpA don't really pay attention to sites like kotaku, or other clickbait game article sites. I didn't think it was a big deal to begin with and so I hadn't posted anything. However I was begining to see more and more games popping up involved in this, games that I have paid for or supported. Currently there is just an all out shit flinging war on twitter between gamers and pseudo-feminists. Right off the bat sites like reddit and a load of smaller forums were being censored at the mention of Zoe Quinn. At this point now, nearly all major game focused sites have been censored from talking about gamegate. This also includes 4chan.

It has become a pretty big deal and it's impossible to catch-up on extent of jaw dropping awfulness this fiasco has turned up. A lot of money has been thrown around, a lot of people have lost their jobs and threats have been tossed about. On both sides of the fence. Pretty much every major game news site has took a stance, even BBC and The Guardian have mentioned it somewhat. Youtubers like JonTron, Total Biscuit and Anita Sarkesian, maybe even fucking Disney (sabotage concerns) and the FBI (racketeering) all have or may have been pulled into this. Before this was just something pretty irrelevant to your average gamer, but this clique and it's mob have made a big impact on indie games.


Crude image sum-up for you:
If you're really interested I've heard good things regarding knowyourmeme as a summary, can't vouch for it myself.
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/quinnspiracy
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/gamergate


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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 14:51 
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This is a complete and utter mess! Even Disney and the FBI are involved! The world is coming to an end.

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nl 
PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 15:10 
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Ooooeeee, internet fights :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 15:34 
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Its lead to the censoring of 4chan. Like, people getting permabanned for stuff that would be really really tame (e.g semi-nudity) by 4chan standards. For that reason alone it's pretty mind-boggling. Hadn't heard about the rest of the stuff, so good to know.

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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 16:43 
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Awesomeassassin wrote:
This is a complete and utter mess! Even Disney and the FBI are involved! The world is coming to an end.
If Phil Fish goes to prison for racketeering there deffinetly won't be a Fez 2 now :lol:
[SpA]Scatterbrain wrote:
Its lead to the censoring of 4chan. Like, people getting permabanned for stuff that would be really really tame (e.g semi-nudity) by 4chan standards. For that reason alone it's pretty mind-boggling. Hadn't heard about the rest of the stuff, so good to know.
Well there are theories to why it's happened, but I can't speak with much certainty. Especially when it comes to 4chan. What is deffinetly known is that m00t the founder is dating someone who's into all the social justice stuff, she's linked to Gawker media who own sites such as Kotaku, Jezebel and Gizmodo. It's speculated that there's probably a lot of pressure on m00t from SJWs, probably more now because of this Emma Watson thing. What they fail to realise though is that there is no general consensus or group on 4chan anymore than there is on say tumblr. m00t's also on good terms with Anita Sarkesian who is just awful, she does the Tropes vs Women videos, which would be really cool if they weren't so heavily agenda driven, doing stuff like cherry picking characters to push her point. Plus the fact she didn't just make them, she asks for the money to make them first and then makes even more cash whenever she tweets that she is being harassed. Literally making cash off being a victim. Also m00t has suppose to of attended a conference she was at aswell. I missed the details, but it's basically ended up with many saying "4chan is kill" and moving over to 8chan.


There is nothing to back this as fact so make of it what you will:
I don't actually know just how intense the censorship has been on these sites, I believe it has come in waves. If you take Something Awful for instance they were very big censorship and bans, but I believe they're allowing discussion now. Damage has been done though, all sites have done mass purges of threads and bans, that is certain.

Regarding 4chan aswell there was The Fine Young Capitalists which was a competition that gives one lucky woman the oppertunity to pitch and maybe create the game they always wanted to make. It came under a lot of mobbing and often had their fundraiser hacked by people suppporting Zoe Quinn, literally on her own twitter proving her own involvement in that. She had issue with their royalties and what they were defining as 'women' and so the press shut their doors to TFYC, no one would talk to them or let them clear the air. In a hilarious twist though /v/ on 4chan ended up largely funding TYFC and even made their own chracter to go in the game as a pledge award. This crowd funded competition appealed to help women, trans women and women of colour and were pretty sincere about it and then this happens. It really exposes what SJWs can be like, they are not feminists or concerned human beings. They are a mob who just speak in the language of equal rights with no true belief in it. Glad to say though TYFC recieved plenty of funding and a lucky dev is set to make their game with /v/'s character included.


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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 17:44 
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Hadn't heard about this until now. This is a really big deal, but I'm not sure what it will take to stop it.

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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 22:32 
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I have seen a lot about this recently and I never really understood what was going on. Thanks a lot for clearing it up a little bit better (I am still pretty confused about it due to I do not understand feminism in general).

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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2014, 23:40 
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[SpA]CoDxFeedz wrote:
Hadn't heard about this until now. This is a really big deal, but I'm not sure what it will take to stop it.
There really isn't much they can do.

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PostPosted: 25 Sep 2014, 00:03 
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Turns out 4chan weren't really threatening to release nudes of Emma Watson. It was a hoax by a viral marketting firm to draw attention to 4chan for being part of the previous celebrity leaks. The said firm called Rantic are now calling out for the shutdown of 4chan. Rough week for them.
[SpA]CoDxFeedz wrote:
Hadn't heard about this until now. This is a really big deal, but I'm not sure what it will take to stop it.
Although GamerGate is under a lot of fire and suppression, it's managed to pull a lot of customers and advertisers away from sites like Kotaku. Mostly by emailing their sponsors which is big blow to them. Zoe Quinn's reputation is now in tatters and will unlikely work with anyone again. Even worse now that she is suing her ex for exposing her. We know at least either the FBI or some investigative body is involved because someone had to take a load of content down that exposed the racketeering as it's considered evidence. Which is good.

On the other hand misinformation has made the larger gaming community look hostile and prejudice to outsiders who don't now any better. That said you can't really beat the internet or gamers in general, they're just people. Public figures and journalist sites however though will only suffer for harming their own audience and acusing them of misogyny. I don't know how this will actually end though, my guess would be more damage will be done to games journalism and give rise to youtubers while the whole thing will just fizzle out until the next big scandal. SJWs very much have their claws into gaming and are determined to change it by harassing game developers, so I have a feeling it will perpetuate itself.

redbanana22 wrote:
I have seen a lot about this recently and I never really understood what was going on. Thanks a lot for clearing it up a little bit better (I am still pretty confused about it due to I do not understand feminism in general).
Well feminism is pretty important as it's about gender inequality how it affects women in paticular. I think in essence though it's about women getting the same respect as men and being allowed to make their own decisions without persecution. That said, unfortunatley that's not what some people who identify as feminists believe, for them it's a trend and an agenda. The movement currently is full of very hateful and bigotted people who are often misandrists and are quite happy to discriminate when it suits them.


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PostPosted: 25 Sep 2014, 01:53 
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[SpA]JuncoPartner wrote:
Turns out 4chan weren't really threatening to release nudes of Emma Watson. It was a hoax by a viral marketting firm to draw attention to 4chan for being part of the previous celebrity leaks. The said firm called Rantic are now calling out for the shutdown of 4chan. Rough week for them.
[SpA]CoDxFeedz wrote:
Hadn't heard about this until now. This is a really big deal, but I'm not sure what it will take to stop it.
Although GamerGate is under a lot of fire and suppression, it's managed to pull a lot of customers and advertisers away from sites like Kotaku. Mostly by emailing their sponsors which is big blow to them. Zoe Quinn's reputation is now in tatters and will unlikely work with anyone again. Even worse now that she is suing her ex for exposing her. We know at least either the FBI or some investigative body is involved because someone had to take a load of content down that exposed the racketeering as it's considered evidence. Which is good.

On the other hand misinformation has made the larger gaming community look hostile and prejudice to outsiders who don't now any better. That said you can't really beat the internet or gamers in general, they're just people. Public figures and journalist sites however though will only suffer for harming their own audience and acusing them of misogyny. I don't know how this will actually end though, my guess would be more damage will be done to games journalism and give rise to youtubers while the whole thing will just fizzle out until the next big scandal. SJWs very much have their claws into gaming and are determined to change it by harassing game developers, so I have a feeling it will perpetuate itself.

redbanana22 wrote:
I have seen a lot about this recently and I never really understood what was going on. Thanks a lot for clearing it up a little bit better (I am still pretty confused about it due to I do not understand feminism in general).
Well feminism is pretty important as it's about gender inequality how it affects women in paticular. I think in essence though it's about women getting the same respect as men and being allowed to make their own decisions without persecution. That said, unfortunatley that's not what some people who identify as feminists believe, for them it's a trend and an agenda. The movement currently is full of very hateful and bigotted people who are often misandrists and are quite happy to discriminate when it suits them.
Thanks for explaining it to me. Now I understand this all better.

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<_blueflame_> Redbanana if we are going to do this right i need you to bend over

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de 
PostPosted: 25 Sep 2014, 20:13 
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So I read a lot about it today morning. Not sure if I remember all the important parts, but I think this is completly blown out of proportion.

A woman cheated to sell her game better. Big deal. Any other area you can think of has cheaters and corruption, why would game development be excluded? Just a matter of time until it happened big time. By pure chance it was a woman, so she is probably not targeted because of being a woman (unless someone points out an earlier incident with a male that didnt blow up as much). Just a huge shitstorm because it was the first of its kind, and shitstorms like to get out of proportion.

Then the media bullshit, that is just stupid. By now people should know that censorship doesn't work out.
And the coordinated attack of the media against gamers: Everybody is a gamer and they are certainly not going to die out. Calling the gamers as whole, that group that probably the most people can identify with nowadays, rage driven haters just because a small subsection of them are responsible for certain actions is certainly not helping our already declining trust in gaming journalism.
I really hope people like TotalBiscuit keep rising in popularity while sell outs like PC Gamer die out as their readership realizes that they praise whoever pays them.


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PostPosted: 25 Sep 2014, 21:46 
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Dekar wrote:
So I read a lot about it today morning. Not sure if I remember all the important parts, but I think this is completly blown out of proportion.

A woman cheated to sell her game better. Big deal. Any other area you can think of has cheaters and corruption, why would game development be excluded? Just a matter of time until it happened big time. By pure chance it was a woman, so she is probably not targeted because of being a woman (unless someone points out an earlier incident with a male that didnt blow up as much). Just a huge shitstorm because it was the first of its kind, and shitstorms like to get out of proportion.
I think people take it very seriously for a number of reasons. Mainstream games had it's fair share of curruption and bribery, but this is a very organised group in indie games. Zoe Quinns contacts are numerous, they range from sucessful indie devs and journalists to moderators on reddit. She used these contacts to promote her game, or pressure sites to censor anything mentioning her in a bad light. She claimed that cheating on someone is virtually rape, and then went on to cheat with five men, and then avoiding, guilt tripping or gas lighting her boyfriend whenever he questioned her about it. That's emotional Abuse. Even used youtubes broken copyright system to remove his video telling people how she had treated him.

Then there's allegedly faking death threats so she could raise more money. This includes showing a couple of her profiles hacked, which based on her screenshots proving her to be logged in still, times of postings, and the fact the supposed 4chan hacker referred to '/v/' as '/V/' has it all pointing at her. Directing money for a game dev competition straight into her personal funds and then claiming proceeds from her game Depression quest go to mental health charities when she pockets all of it. Lets not forget getting a women's game dev competition hacked and cut off from the gaming press. Now Zoe Quinn is not what GamerGate is all about, but that's enough to put her on anyones shit list.

I don't think it's been proven as legit, but mailing lists have been dug up and fired employers have come forward to show that these game journalists are all touch with eachother, and that's why 10-14 "Gamers are dead" articles sprung on the same day. They are also buddied up with the indie game developers. What good is a review for a game when the reviewer is their friend? It wouldn't really matter if they at least disclosed their relationships with the game developers. If they claim to be journalists then they must be held to the same standards of all journalists if we're expecting them to review games fairly. You can't have financial or social ties with them.


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de 
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2014, 03:16 
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Well, the list of her deeds is certainly impressive. :ugly:
Its weird though why people don't care as much when bigger companies pull such shit.

My current favorite internet drama is about PGI/IPG of Mech Warriors Online/Transverse "fame".
Most of it can be read here http://themittani.com/content/traffic-c ... nsreversal .

Highlights:
-PGI crowdfounds MWO, gathers millions of dollars, fails to deliver a dynamic star map where people fight over plants for 2 years after official release and 5 deadlines, while shitting out more and more mechs for people to buy including 500$ golden mechs.
-As people get angrier they ban more agressively negative comments on their forum. At the end you even get banned on their forum if you talked negativly about MWO on facebook or other third party sites.
-Publisher IPG that allegidly was founded by the same people who founded the devloper PGI keep selling founder packages for Mech Warrior Tactics event though the third party developer team stopped working on it for months without anyone knowing, until one day the website goes into infinite maintance mode.
-Not yet happy with the amount of unfinished games and angry customer they have, PGI announces Transverse, a space sandbox MMORPG not unlike Star Citizen. All experienced people get drawn off of MWO and replaced by a new, unexperienced team.
-The complete PGI team gets shadowbanned on Reddit, as they created the Transverse subreddit and moderate it like their forum, deleting all negative comments. Comments on their videos get disabled, videos get reuploaded to reset downvotes by angry MWO players.
-PC Gamer praises Transverse just as it praised MWO, even though there hardly any info out and the development team does not exactly have a good track record.
-PGI said they could have used the Wing Commander license and decided against it, but EA denies ever giving them the rights.
-Transverse pledge currently horribly failing, even after they halved the minimum amount needed after the first days.



They are not that unsimiliar to Zoe Quinn, although luckily they lack the influental connections:
Misuse of money
Silencing of critics
People defending PGI/MWO are often called white knights, while people attacking Quinn are "gamers". Maybe because Quinn got the vocal majority as in gaming press on her side while the critical community has the vocal majority in MWO.
Lots of lies for their benefit
Manipulation of Gaming Media


Maybe with Kickstarter games failing to deliver and the already known corruption in gaming media, there is just nothing really interesting anymore with what PGI/IPG does.
That game dev woman having affairs to promote her own games just is a much more interesting story, no matter how much damage it caused in the end (Is it known how much money she earned?).

Bonus Section:
I read about 4chan and their actions like "free bleeding". :ugly:
So Quinn being a woman certainly might have helped with the shitstorm.

The Quinspiracy and Gamergate are really hard to discuss without knowing exactly everything that happened, in addition to knowing what is truth and what not.


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PostPosted: 26 Sep 2014, 13:20 
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That's awful man. I pretty much dropped MWO as soon as Hawken came out, but I didn't think it was going to end up like that. The devs seemed serious about it since it's an old franchise. Guess it's another Tribes Ascend fiasco. Tranverse looks shit. It sounds like they couldn't make the amount of money they wanted from MWO and that they're not going to make the money they want from Tranverse either.

I think it's quite easy to end up on right side of Gamergate and Quinn scandal, and many have flipped over once being informed. The anti-gamer campaign sort of crumbles under scrutiny. As far as I know all they have is that Zoe Quinn was recieving a lot of bad feedback and reportedly harassment before any of this when she was trying to get Depression Quest greenlit on steam. I believe the contoversy was mostly down to it being in the grey area between a game and an interactive story, and people just hating SJWs in general. Then there's the moral grey area on whether her ex should have made the Zoe Post exposing her abuse and curruption, because while it is in the public interest because of what she claims to stand for and the paticular people she slept with, it is still her personal business. There are misogynists in gaming who do send threats and dumb shit to women, so there is that.

What I will say though, for a mob of angry gamers GamerGate colectively has a lot of restraint as they know making sexist remarks only gives ammo to the opposition and validates their defense that gamer's are mysogynists. SJWs and the like though don't seem to share this self control. I've been trying to find some of the racist, mysogynistic(yep) and transphobic comments some of their public figures have made, but you'll have to look yourself for proof, but it is there. The hippocracy they exhibit though is beyond the worst you would expect.

There are differences between GamerGate and MWO, or any other scandals that involve EA, the dorrito pope and the seemingly weekly mainstream gaming scandals. Firstly it's the indie scene, we foolishy expected better of smaller developers and jounalists. Because of mass censorship and the amount of indie devs and games involved, it's made it very relevant to people who probably didn't care what Kotaku or the Quinnspiracy was originally. Didn't help they made all those inflammatory articles either. They poked the beehive themselves.

It's hard to write without a bias, because this is a very lopsided event. I don't think I could even play devil's advocate if I tried. While it's difficult to say what is truth and what isn't, there is more than enough. A lot of the info has actually come from the twitter feeds of the offending game devs and journalists, some of them made little effort to hide what they were doing. We only know that Zoe was indirectly involved in hacking TYFC because of her posts on twitter for example.


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au 
PostPosted: 18 Nov 2014, 12:48 
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I guess this is what happens when two opposing internet cultures finally go to war

oh and corruption and self-interest from small groups on both sides. this would almost be hilarious if a lot of cash money wasn't involved.

in a way you could say it's what might happen among a group of pirates, there's no laws on the internet and nobody knows who anyone is until they raise a flag supporting one side or the other. pretty interesting from a power struggle standpoint, especially when you factor in just how big these industries are

media, devs, consumers, a mix of people with interests in a range of all three categories... Whew! Makes you wonder why anyone watches TV shows when you could just log into a website somewhere and BANG, drama!

Who's the anti- Oppressive-SJWs Lenin gonna be, I wonder? Also, do we fear that sjw political correctness will have an impact on games in the future? What's happening with all this false advertising, fraud and corruption? Find out in GamerGate Season II!


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PostPosted: 18 Nov 2014, 13:33 
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It's still going on strong. Will be interesting when the FBI closes in though. I'll post the source if I find it, but allegedly someone has snitched on the racketeering group for a reduced sentence and they're also investigating someone who was faking their own death threats.


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au 
PostPosted: 22 Nov 2014, 03:25 
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Classic!


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