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 Post subject: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 09:13 
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http://www.teamfortress.com/gunmettle/

Alot of class and weapon updates in this one.

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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 12:42 
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There is just wayy too much crazy shit in this update to comment on, but I have to say like 90% of those balance changes look like good shit.

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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 13:06 
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Dead Ringer now useless, spies once again unable to get anywhere near a chokepoint. :cry:
Now its a watch that doesnt really protect you from damage, which has to be used at full health and always decloaks you after 7 seconds with no cloak bar but with a loud sound that gives you away.

(edit: ok maybe with spycicle and l'etranger DR might still work to get behind lines)

Pyro now op with ranged area of effect minicrit flareguns. :5:

Valve is not making TF2 more competitive, they just slowly turn it into a 1:1 copy of CS:GO. :|


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 13:43 
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I hate VALVe. Pay for play, fuck you, I payed 60 euro's for this game already!! :evil:


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 13:57 
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(Started writing this in the morning before the above posts)

Don't care about cs:go-ifying the weapons, I play with viewmodels turned off anyway :ugly:

Quote:
Random Damage Spread is off by default (ConVar tf_damage_disablespread is set to 1).


Only took you about SEVEN YEARS Valve! :demm: Now give us tf_use_fixed_weaponspreads 1 and/or turn off random crits please :mrgreen:

Borneo's pretty good, haven't played Suijin but it looks gorgeous, and holy shit they actually added Snowplow!

Quote:
New feature : Weapon exchange and pick up. Weapons dropped by killed players can no longer be picked up for ammo. Killed players will now also drop a medium ammo box. Players that can normally equip the dropped weapon (proper class) can look at the weapon and press the 'action key' to exchange it with what they have equipped. The player's equipped weapon will be dropped on the exchange.


Really interesting, obviously it's mostly a way to get people to care about skins but I'm wondering if there's anything cool you can do with this gameplay wise. It wouldn't be consistent because what they drop is random but it's still interesting.

Quote:
Spy no longer smacks himself in the face while reloading a revolver (New Spy revolver reload animation that does not block cross hair)


Cool!

Quote:
Changing to a new disguise while already under a disguise takes 0.5 seconds instead of the normal disguise time of 2 seconds


How much does this buff disguises? I don't play spy enough to know myself. Might be useful?

Quote:
While invisible, Spy receives 20% less damage from all damage sources


Huh. Ok.

Spycicle changes are a nerf - pyro's will be able to find them after they pop spycicle although they won't be able to track them with their afterburn, they'll have to follow them with the flamethrower for a while. Seems sensible, the downside of failed medic picks was real but on the whole spycicle was by far the best-in-slot (maybe still is?)

Quote:
Enforcer

Changed +20% damage bonus while undisguised to +20% damage bonus while disguised


Not broken anymore? Glad to see they've decreased its power though, that thing was crazy.

[It's at this point I'm realising just how much stuff they've rebalanced but I'll keep posting my initial reaction :mrgreen:)

Quote:
Big Earner

Added 3 second speed gain on kill


It's not useless anymore! Cool mechanic.

Kunai still seems bad, just less bad I suppose.

Nice buff to CnD, it's a cool watch that got a bit overshadowed by DR in pubs.

Big changes to DR! Will have to see how this plays out to get a feel for it.

Quote:
Increased base wrench construction speed on hit boost by 50%. Buildings now build 2.5x faster instead of just 2x (additive of 1.5x + base speed)


Afaik this just applies to the initial set-up time of level 1 buildings? Doesn't seem to be that big a deal.

Quote:
Building pick up speed penalty reduced from 25% to 10%


Nice quality-of-life change.

Quote:
On Wrench equip change, buildings no longer self-destruct unless the building type is changed (i.e. Only Sentry explodes when switching from Wrench to Gunslinger)
Don't care about the csgo-ifying of weapon


Yay! Was annoying not being able to switch from gunslinger to normal wrench cos I'd lose my tele :26

Quote:
Building repair costs increased from 20 metal to 33 metal to repair 100hp per wrench hit (from 5HP per metal to 3HP per metal)


More repair per swing and more metal cost, interesting. I've not found that running out of metal while tanking a sentry is a problem so I think this pretty much just a buff to repairs. Given how much you can tank with the wrangler shield + rescue ranger I don't think this was needed but ok then. [edit: obviously not the case any more lol]

Quote:
Mini Sentries can now be repaired


Wat :ugly:

Quote:
Mini Sentries can now be wrench construction boosted
Mini Sentry base build speed decreased. Mini Sentries that are wrench boosted build slightly faster than previously.
Mini Sentries start at 50% health on construction and gain health during construction instead of starting at 100%


Nerfs! But mostly for the really offensive minis I think, the ones plopped down defensively will still be horrible. But hey valve nerfed minis at least a little bit woo!!!

Quote:
Wrangler

Ammo and Repair given to a shielded Sentry is reduced by the strength of the shield (66% reduced) when shield is active


Disregard what I said earlier about tanking sentries, big nerf here. Especially to the rescue ranger given the changes to wrench repairing. I guess it was coming because they were a pain in the ass to kill, I just hope the wrangler's still good enough to be viable cos I really liked that playstyle.

Jag is fixed at least, even though it does slightly lower repair-per-swing the faster swing might just make it the most useful for repairing sentries. Yay for options!

Being able to spam Short Circuit and just deny all projectiles was bullshit, at least there's a little bit of skill involved in timing your hits now. Probably still bullshit though :ugly:

Eureka Effect is now non-terrible, not sure if it'll actually be used with the 50%-metal-pickups thing but at least you'll actually be able to repair the sentries that you put up.

Quote:
Baby Face's Blaster

Added Boost reduction on taking damage.
Increased amount of Boost lost on air jump


Will see how it plays how but I was hoping for more. If you can't hit them in the first place then I don't think slowing them down on taking damage will make much difference. Maybe it's a severe decrease, we'll see.

Excited to see that Pocket Pistol is no longer automatically best in slot! Goodbye +15hp bonus, nobody actually liked being forced to use you :mrgreen: Super interesting tradeoff mechanic here, well done valve.

Airstrike really was crap, dunno if this is enough to make it viable. Sensible changes at least.

Quote:
Equalizer and Escape Plan

Changed no healing penalty to 90% less healing from Medics while active


Not that important cos they have to change away from it anyway but this is a thoughtful change anyway.

Blackbox changes seem inconsequential? Dunno if I'm missing anything but I don't think this'll change much.

Quote:
Liberty Launcher

Now has +25% clip size


Still a noob-magnet probably :ugly:

Quote:
Loch-n-Load

Changed +20% damage bonus to +20% damage against buildings


Downgraded from 'spammy undodgable bullshit' to just 'spammy and undodgable'. At least it's not doing 120hp and nearly one-shotting light classes anymore. Thank fuck they've done something about it anyway.

Quote:
Quickiebomb Launcher

Damage is now increased based on charge amount when the bomb is fired


SNIPER DEMOMAN AAAAAAA

Quote:
Scorch Shot

Hits and explosions always minicrit burning targets


Wow, scorch shot was in a fine place before but now it's pretty lethal.

Will have to test the new detonator jump, glad to see it's being made more interesting.

Vaccinator sounds kind of insane now, another one I'll have to see in-game to see how it works.

Hoovy changes!

Quote:
Natascha

Added 20% damage resistance while spun up


Does this include 'spun up' include 'while firing'? If so then in a Sascha vs. Natascha fight there's now very little difference between who wins, assuming both start firing at the same time. 30% more spinup time isn't *that* big a deal so I think Natascha is really competitive now.

Quote:
Tomislav

Now 20% more accurate (less spread)
Increased spin up bonus from 10% to 20%


The 10% difference was absolutely miniscule so that's a fair enough buff. Interested to see how the greater accuracy plays out, might be really annoying to play against if heavy's are now good at ranged fights.

+ lots of nice changes to his underpowered unlocks. I think Sandvich is still king but it's nice that they're buffing the alternatives a bit.

Increased switch speed to panic attack might just be enough to make it viable. I wonder if it stacks with the degreaser switch speed? Another interesting option.

-

Pretty awesome balance changes on the whole. If anything they could've afforded to go even further with some of them but most of this is a step in the right direction. It's been a long time since the game got this kind of polish, good to see them continue to invest in it :4

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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 13:57 
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[SpA]SaintK wrote:
I hate VALVe. Pay for play, fuck you, I payed 60 euro's for this game already!! :evil:


Nope, completely optional.

Tbh if they want money for some compeltely superfluous cosmetics then that's fine by me, it means they're not putting the actually important content behind a paywall. In fact they just gave us 3 4 new maps and a fuckload of balance changes for free, and if that's being funded by people who like weird looking weapons then good, I look forward to another ~10 years of free TF2 for me! And when there are like a thousand cosmetic options in the game already that are pretty much free then I don't care about about a minigun in Christmas wrapping paper :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 15:31 
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So thinking about a few changes.

-No spread/random damage! :shock: I guess they can't part with random crits for competitive because weapons are balanced based on crits.
-Autoreload on by default now! Noobs now buffed by 15%!

-20% damage resist on cloaked spies is great and well overdue in the chaos of modern tf2.
-Reload anim for the revolvers should be way less intrusive.
-Cloak and dagger buff :mrgreen:

Not sure what to make of the engineer changes, seems they're opting for quicker and more disposable engineer buildings, instead of turtling. Which could actually be good. Any nerf to mini-sentries is welcome, but at the end of the day they will still lockdown scouts, pyros and jumpers with little or no effort on the engineers part, and that sucks for the game. Looks like it will be much harder if not impossible to run strats like we did with the rescure ranger and wrangler in 4v4.


-Pocket pistol heals 3+ per shot, still stops fall damage but has a 20% damage vunerability while active. I'm deffinetlly using this!

-The air strike rocket launcher sounds way easier to get rolling, looking forward to using it.

-The equalizer/escape plan allow for 10% heals, so easy uber building basically.

-Demoknight buffs, no nerfs? :? Still can't set targe demomen on fire, so utterly stupid.

-Loch and Load has lost it's teeth, does regular damage to players. I guess that's good.

-Scorch shot might actually be worth using and detonator might even be on par with flaregun now since flare detonations/spash will minicrit burning players. Plus better jumps :5:

-Sydney sleeper buff :?

-Some decent heavy buffs.

Plus a heap load of smaller but welcome tweaks to weapons like the bushwacka. I share scatter's sentiment on that, the painted weapons are goofy, but worth it if it means they can ship some new maps and some surprisingly good balancing.

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<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 17:12 
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[SpA]Scatterbrain wrote:
[SpA]SaintK wrote:
I hate VALVe. Pay for play, fuck you, I payed 60 euro's for this game already!! :evil:


Nope, completely optional.

Tbh if they want money for some compeltely superfluous cosmetics then that's fine by me, it means they're not putting the actually important content behind a paywall. In fact they just gave us 3 4 new maps and a fuckload of balance changes for free, and if that's being funded by people who like weird looking weapons then good, I look forward to another ~10 years of free TF2 for me! And when there are like a thousand cosmetic options in the game already that are pretty much free then I don't care about about a minigun in Christmas wrapping paper :mrgreen:


I know it's optional, but I do not want to pay for features on a game which I already supposedly bought the full version off.

I am fine with them charging for features, but if you do, then refund me my original purchase and let me use the money to buy the new features.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 21:46 
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Why all the changes?
It is an old game that is free to play for a long time already.
So all the changes will not bring a high wave of new players but will annoy old players and they might quit the game.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2015, 21:58 
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[SpA]Dunken wrote:
Why all the changes?
It is an old game that is free to play for a long time already.
So all the changes will not bring a high wave of new players but will annoy old players and they might quit the game.


For me personally it's changes like these that make me want to play. If TF2 was as badly balanced as it was in say mid 2011? I would have probably ragequit by now. Plus weapons that were junk before are actually useful now.

So much more fun now thesedays. Just a few things like the pyro-proof demoknight shield and mini-sentry spam that bugs me, hopfully they'll fix those one day. Oh and also if they increased heavies spin up time and decreased his spindown time. So he's actually fun to play, and less annoying to fight. It's not impossible. Today has shown us it's all possible.

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<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 03 Jul 2015, 02:50 
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Just tried some things out after I got home from work -

- (edit: confirmed to be a bug, patch coming today) I *think* it's a bug from the changes they made to Battalion's Backup but rocket jumping is insane now! When I do a standard crouchjump rocketjump it feels like I'm on playing at about 85% of normal gravity. I get the same feeling from sticky jumping too. Apparently the changes have also broken advanced techniques like pogos, will test it when I'm less tired.

- Detonator jumps are pretty meaty, not sure how much of this is related to overall momentum changes like the above.

- If you hit your sentry whilst it is deploying (i.e from the moment you put it down til it reaches level 1) then it builds pretty damn quickly, even moreso with the Jag. Minis now build significantly slower. I didn't time it but I think deploying a level 1 while hitting it with the jag is faster than building a minisentry and not hitting it. You still have to factor in stuff like mini's being cheap enough that you can plop down two of them in quick succession, but in situations like pushing the payload cart where you have that extra metal I think we'll see offensive level 1 sentries much more often now.

- You still upgrade your buildings at 25/metal per swing; the Jag swings faster than other wrenches, therefore your buildings get upgraded faster; therefore Jag > vanilla wrench/Southern Hospitality now. Eureka Effect is kinda doing its own thing so it's difficult to compare it with that, but as far as I'm concerned the Jag is the new king.

More experiments tomorrow morning probably :-11

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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 03 Jul 2015, 14:02 
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Some thigns that were missed in the original patch notes -

Quote:
Power Jack
Reduced health gained on kill from +75hp to +25hp
Cozy Camper
Removed increased damage taken penalty
Rescue Ranger
Decreased cost of long range building pick up from 130 metal to 100 metal

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ュ~ちゃんgamer.jp Pinky: till you're senseless


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 03 Jul 2015, 14:50 
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Ah damn forgot to try out jag with lvl 1s!

So the scorch shot is an entirely new beast now. Gonna have to play some more with it to be sure, but with the extra damage and knockback on burning players it's become a much more disruptive weapon. The lower damage seems to be compensated by the garenteed minicrit splash and knockback on anything you're fighting. Seems to be more of harass and hide weapon as you still lack the ability to quick kill. Chaining airblasts the extra knockback looks potent too.

Airstrike aswell seems balanced now, a noticeably weaker launcher that you pretty much need to equip the parachute with to make the most of, BUT you become a deadly force in the air once you get a kill or two. This is especially dangerous when you max the clipsize to 8 because you're almost garenteed a crit.

Iron bomber and quickie launcher (edit: actually I can't seem to do the charge on it hm, 90-100 damage is regular right?) just seem all round better and synergise quite well together.

Pocket pistol is quite disappointing. 3+ hp per shot is nothing paired with slower firing speed.

Quote:
Power Jack
Reduced health gained on kill from +75hp to +25hp

Image

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<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2015, 03:15 
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Noticed a lot of changes to the tournament functions and UI, competitive is coming :o

Quote:
Added a slider to the Advanced Options menu that adjusts the volume of the hit sound when you damage an enemy
Nice


So this board is on the new powerhouse map



Some strings for competitive found ingame:

_________________
<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2015, 07:16 
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Geek (630)
[SpA]JuncoPartner wrote:
Some strings for competitive found ingame:



"TF_Matchmaking_MissingTicket" "%s1 doesn't have a ticket"

"TF_Competitive_Pass" "Competitive Matchmaking Beta Pass"
"TF_Competitive_RequiresPass" "To play in ranked competitive modes, you must own a Competitive Matchmaking Beta Pass."


Yes, looks like Valves TF2 comp mode should bring them money...with tickets you have to buy to play ranked matches. Selling tickets has worked with MvM , works with Gumettle...they will try it with comp.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2015, 11:07 
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[SpA]Dunken wrote:
[SpA]JuncoPartner wrote:
Some strings for competitive found ingame:



"TF_Matchmaking_MissingTicket" "%s1 doesn't have a ticket"

"TF_Competitive_Pass" "Competitive Matchmaking Beta Pass"
"TF_Competitive_RequiresPass" "To play in ranked competitive modes, you must own a Competitive Matchmaking Beta Pass."


Yes, looks like Valves TF2 comp mode should bring them money...with tickets you have to buy to play ranked matches. Selling tickets has worked with MvM , works with Gumettle...they will try it with comp.


Pretty sure those passes are just a way of limiting the beta testers. CS:GO matchmaking is completely free and it looks like they're just porting that system into TF2. Matchmaking is the big thing that Valve want to get more people interested in TF2 and keep them playing in the same way that it (and skins) are keeping CS:GO alive. They're also supporting it by putting twitch streams in-game the same way CS:GO does and will be rebalancing weapons according to the statistics they get from matchmaking. They want as many people to be playing matchmaking and competitive TF2 as possible so I'd be very surprised if they start charging people for it.

At the very worst I think there could be a one-time payment to access it, say 2 euros. Would kinda suck but at least it would keep total noobs out of competitive.

Anyway, speaking of competitive -

Quote:
Dropped weapons now retain their ammo and ÜberCharge levels unless the player commits suicide


Run kritz to mid > kill their med > pick up his gun with 90% uber on it > instead of a ~40% kritz advantage you have a 100% uber advantage :shock: Also, medics will now need to have a suicide bind and/or switch away from their medigun just before they die. Also soldiers and demos will have to use their explosions to knock the medigun either toward their own medic or away from the other team depending, or at least use the dropped medigun as bait. Interesting stuff.

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ュ~ちゃんgamer.jp Pinky: doesn't make sense
ュ~ちゃんgamer.jp Pinky: till you're senseless


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2015, 01:25 
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I love this update.
They made the game more balanced with the weapon changes and gives us a wide variety of choices to make on ingame situations.
The contracts give us something to accomplish while playing and i love the skins tbh. (idk when the crates gonna start droppin)
The downside is with all the bugs and exploits.
Payload is useless to play right now because there is an exploit where you go to the last point and do the high five taunt animation and then commit suicide and it will cap the point instantly.
Another one is that you can kill people with your short circuit after you gotten defeated.
And you can disguise while having the eternal reward if you kill yourself and pick up the YER again.
It seems alot of people are crashing frequently so hopefully Valve will patch things up soon.

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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2015, 03:36 
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[SpA]Scatterbrain wrote:
Run kritz to mid > kill their med > pick up his gun with 90% uber on it > instead of a ~40% kritz advantage you have a 100% uber advantage :shock: Also, medics will now need to have a suicide bind and/or switch away from their medigun just before they die. Also soldiers and demos will have to use their explosions to knock the medigun either toward their own medic or away from the other team depending, or at least use the dropped medigun as bait. Interesting stuff.


Think this is only the case for friendly mediguns.



It's not a real tf2 update unless there are some wacky game crippling bugs :ugly:



_________________
<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2015, 04:52 
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For those who may not have seen it:


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Procrastination is like a credit card: it's a lot of fun until you get the bill.
-Christopher Parker


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2015, 12:18 
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The weapons are just mods in the guys files, probably from playing advanced weaponizer. He confirms this in the comments.

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<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2015, 12:37 
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Incredible how the same payload bugs keep popping up. They probably let their interns fix the bugs. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2015, 00:03 
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[SpA]JuncoPartner wrote:
The weapons are just mods in the guys files, probably from playing advanced weaponizer. He confirms this in the comments.

Funny how he keeps the video up then.

Either way, I hope competitive will be free but also use a leveling system like they just added to CS:GO to keep new players form jumping straight into matchmaking,

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Procrastination is like a credit card: it's a lot of fun until you get the bill.
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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 07 Jul 2015, 15:27 
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So has anyone been following that community Invasion project?

Well they've since made a pretty fancy unlisted youtube vid for it:


This is their item collection, also aware of a bunch of maps they held a competition for including the UFO:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =312298750

_________________
<Gandolf> I ate too much fish.
<Gandolf> It was way too salty, too.
<Gandolf> But god, was it good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 09 Jul 2015, 16:57 
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Dekar wrote:
Incredible how the same payload bugs keep popping up. They probably let their interns fix the bugs. :mrgreen:


Quote:
Fixed an exploit related to instantly completing a payload map while taunting and picking up dropped weapons.


:roll:

Is it so hard to check if whatever object is on the point is actually a payload cart? After the third time they fixed the same bug they maybe should look into ways to permanently fix it for the future.


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 Post subject: Re: The Gunmettle Update
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2015, 23:38 
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Dekar wrote:
Is it so hard to check if whatever object is on the point is actually a payload cart? After the third time they fixed the same bug they maybe should look into ways to permanently fix it for the future.


Of course it would be more involved than that but it's pretty much as simple as adding like 20 lines of code if the engine can tell what entities are what.
:18

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