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 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jun 2012, 07:05 
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Kinda hopeless, but improving (134)
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I've loved the server ever since I joined, I would hate to see it die. I've not been having very much fun since it started to lose players, since I lost alot of friends when people started to leave, the new players I have been seeing is about 5 a day but they dont stay, I have tried my best to help every new player to get them to stay but they dont and yesterday I was helping a guest who was begging me for stuff. I gave him so of my food amd took him to bedlam and he asked where do I build so I took him to where he could build and helped him build a house, I have not seen him back so ithink he found a new server witch is sad because it means one less person.

If theres anything I can do to help keep the server alive I will

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pt 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jun 2012, 13:01 
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Doesn't get out much (316)
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redbanana22 wrote:
I've loved the server ever since I joined, I would hate to see it die. I've not been having very much fun since it started to lose players, since I lost alot of friends when people started to leave, the new players I have been seeing is about 5 a day but they dont stay, I have tried my best to help every new player to get them to stay but they dont and yesterday I was helping a guest who was begging me for stuff. I gave him so of my food amd took him to bedlam and he asked where do I build so I took him to where he could build and helped him build a house, I have not seen him back so ithink he found a new server witch is sad because it means one less person.

If theres anything I can do to help keep the server alive I will
Redbanana I know how you feel and probably many people do, and if you want to help then you must, you MUST, give suggestions, give us your opinion on what the server lacks, what it needs to be fixed .. go look through our posts mine for example, when i answer howards '' questionnaire '' .. you could do the same answering with your own opinion.. Hope this somehow helped ;) Cheers! :18

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"All the ways you wish you could be, thats me, I look like you wanna look, I fuck like you wanna fuck, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the way's that you are not. "


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de 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jun 2012, 18:47 
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Crap at posting (47)
ells551 wrote:
Right before we go on about other things that are so wrong with the server why don't we switch the spawns right now and get started, otherwise it will be a long time and it will be a lot of changes at once so why not gradually just ease some changes into the server, so why not start with moving the spawn.

ells is right, we need to start moving accurate.

We need to start testing ideas, even if it's only for a week.
GIve it a scheme, a time schedule or something.
But just start moving.
And I'm sure we all are willing to help, so start asking people for help.

Regards,

hwin

_________________
School is sucking up my head.
Luckily I left it in my bed :3


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jun 2012, 20:53 
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Lord of Minecraft (2894)
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hwinwuzhere wrote:
ells551 wrote:
Right before we go on about other things that are so wrong with the server why don't we switch the spawns right now and get started, otherwise it will be a long time and it will be a lot of changes at once so why not gradually just ease some changes into the server, so why not start with moving the spawn.

ells is right, we need to start moving accurate.

We need to start testing ideas, even if it's only for a week.
GIve it a scheme, a time schedule or something.
But just start moving.
And I'm sure we all are willing to help, so start asking people for help.

Regards,

hwin

And this is, I suppose, a good idea, but again you are not realising the work involved and the lack of people there are to do it. Moreover: what ideas? I am not seeing a list of potential suggestions to be implemented here. Sure the spawns need swapping - that's a given - but as I say, that is a huge piece of work and you STILL have not decided what spawn will be in bedlam nor how it will function nor whether there will be a training section (nor how it might function) nor whether the AcceptRules plugin stays nor...the list goes on. You need to make a LOT of decisions before anything can be changed.

_________________
"Fire rained from the sky on the day I was born: 10,000 lives I ended before drawing first breath. Do not speak to me of guilt or regret, Jonathan.” - Brayan, The Keepers of the Fire


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pt 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jun 2012, 21:33 
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Doesn't get out much (316)
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Basically what howard is trying to say, or i guess he is, at least in my comprehension, is that everyone should do something like I did and answer the lot of questions howard asked here :
[SpA]Howard wrote:
Ok they only ting agreed (well not really but let's use that word) is the need for the Server's spawn to be moved to Bedlam. This can be done but as it will probably have to be me doing it it will have to wait.

In the meantime, everyone who wants to play on this server will need to put their efforts into rethinking the basic working of this server. Stop rattling on about adding things, about having Hunger Games and about having a new server. It is just not helpful. Concentrate on the core ideas:
- Residence: do you want it? How should it work?
- Bedlam: should it still be the free for all it is now? How else should it work? What permissions will guests get?
- Teleporting/travel. Both Bedlam and Hub still need better ways of traversing them. DO you want to go as far as having something like Babel back? Reduced cool-down on /home or /spawn? You want a smaller teleport network? Where will they be and why? Should the commands (home/spawn etc) be timer based or chargeable? Both?
- What will be used as the new Spawn in Bedlam? Spawn City is staying in Hub and can be expanded with more facilities (Citizens has been back for months as I told everyone but no one bothered to put it back in)
- Do you still want the AcceptRules plugin? If so, does it happen in Bedlam or Hub? If not, how else will you control/educate the new guys?
- Economy - tied into the Residence issues: what is it for? Is it doing its job? is earning money to pay rent to protect your stuff fun? Do you want other things to spend the money on? If so what?
- Theme Zones - are they DOA or still worthy trying? If they are worth trying then decide exactly how they work.

And that is just the stuff I though of in 5 minutes before I had my breakfast. :lol: No one is going to decide this for you. I tried that and all I got was a migraine. The people who use this server need to say what they want, what kind of experience they want. Think of it from all angles; as a player and as an OP. What do you want to do, what rules should there be, how would you police those rules as Admin. Post ideas here or start new threads - I don't care - but you have to get this done or SMP will be over. :18
If you guys look at my post like Pizza did and argued with my opinions then we would get somewhere, and we would get even further if each and everyone one of the people that are active mainly on SMP and on the forum part of SMP did the same.. Now, I'm not saying that giving out ideas as you come up with them is bad but its just not as good as focusing on the core! Answering these questions to Howard is what we need to do right now, so that we can see a pattern creating, on which we will then , eventually make our decisions on. I know, and you all may know that the one that will, or i guess will eventually, deal with all these problems will be Howard and the one fixing them will be Howard, so giving a little help isnt difficult.
Ok i may have talked too much, but i just simply expressed what i had in mind, cause i'm really sick and tired ( i dont mean to be rude in any way ) of people saying, is the server down ? why dont we do this and do that ? .. Argh .. Now i imagine how howard must feel, I would not be surprised if he had given up on smp... Well, enough rambling, I'm off, later!

_________________
"All the ways you wish you could be, thats me, I look like you wanna look, I fuck like you wanna fuck, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the way's that you are not. "


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de 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 11 Jun 2012, 11:14 
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Crap at posting (47)
[SpA]Howard wrote:
hwinwuzhere wrote:


ells is right, we need to start moving accurate.

We need to start testing ideas, even if it's only for a week.
GIve it a scheme, a time schedule or something.
But just start moving.
And I'm sure we all are willing to help, so start asking people for help.

Regards,

hwin

And this is, I suppose, a good idea, but again you are not realising the work involved and the lack of people there are to do it. Moreover: what ideas? I am not seeing a list of potential suggestions to be implemented here. Sure the spawns need swapping - that's a given - but as I say, that is a huge piece of work and you STILL have not decided what spawn will be in bedlam nor how it will function nor whether there will be a training section (nor how it might function) nor whether the AcceptRules plugin stays nor...the list goes on. You need to make a LOT of decisions before anything can be changed.
"And this is, I suppose, a good idea," - Thank you for this

"but again you are not realising the work involved and the lack of people there are to do it." - I can somehow understand, but we have a lot of people who can help us, only thing is: You need to ask them!

"Moreover: what ideas?" - This I don't fully understand, there are loads of ideas. The only problem is that either Howard or another OP+ thinks it's not a good idea. The idea of this plan was to test all kinds of ideas, as long as it isn't ridiculous.

And RD is right, we need your questions answered (the ones from 5 minutes before breakfest thing :) ).

Hope I updated the idea a bit with this.

-hwin

_________________
School is sucking up my head.
Luckily I left it in my bed :3


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 09:10 
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Has no REAL life! (1620)
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Here's a point if anyone wants to take one from me.

As I'd un-installed minecraft I lost well everything MC related. When I re-installed it I needed to find the server for SpA SMP. Took me 30 minutes to find it wading through the forums. If you wan't new players publicising might help but actually showing them there is a server and where it is would help even more, I doubt anyone just looking to game will have my stamina in finding the address.

The address isn't in a sticky or announcement in any obvious place I could see, SMP isn't listed as part of our minecraft service on the front of the site. If people can't find it at all publicising it will mean nothing.

If you want this problem corrected: Take a look at what information there is listed for Freebuild on the front of the site and write a version for SMP, I'll put it up myself, then write the post you wan't with the server info and we'll make that a sticky or announcement.

Also you should thank Ivan who's approaching this from yet another angle i.e. bringing people over from freebuild.

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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 09:37 
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Lord of Minecraft (2894)
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@cardboard

Absolutely. But, do you know how much of our Freebuild or SMP traffic comes via the website? Zero: absolutely nil. With the exclusion of a few people who played TF2 and showed up on our SMP server for 10 seconds to see what all the forum-fuss was about, no one has ever arrived at our website before SMP.

SMP is advertised on several forums and is listed on many SMP apps - unfortunately it has a bad score on most apps as only those who have been banned ever bother to rate it.

Does it need more advertising? Yes, but our issue is not guests - we still average 10-15 completely new visitors per day. Our issue is that they do not stay as a) our rules and set up are overly complicated because b) no one is on the server to make them welcome (I know: there are a few of you who are always there and always make new guys welcome, but the amount of times I have watched IRC or read logs and seen a new guy wailing for help while OPs just giggle amongst themselves and ignore them is astonishing).

The whole ethos of the server has to change. A better balance must be struck between having a self managing server were grief of any serious nature is impossible and a server where new guys feel like they have any power at all. The change of Spawn will help that (if anyone ever comes here, has the discussion and decides how that change will be done) but more is still needed. My changes to this server made it far, far easier for OPs as they no longer had to worry about new guys griefing (and this was the major complaint I got - that OPs never got to play the game, just manage it) but on the counter swing my changes made it so easy for OPs that they apparently had nothing left to do and left.

_________________
"Fire rained from the sky on the day I was born: 10,000 lives I ended before drawing first breath. Do not speak to me of guilt or regret, Jonathan.” - Brayan, The Keepers of the Fire


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 09:48 
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Has no REAL life! (1620)
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[SpA]Howard wrote:
@cardboard
The whole ethos of the server has to change. A better balance must be struck between having a self managing server were grief of any serious nature is impossible and a server where new guys feel like they have any power at all. The change of Spawn will help that (if anyone ever comes here, has the discussion and decides how that change will be done) but more is still needed. My changes to this server made it far, far easier for OPs as they no longer had to worry about new guys griefing (and this was the major complaint I got - that OPs never got to play the game, just manage it) but on the counter swing my changes made it so easy for OPs that they apparently had nothing left to do and left.
Not disputing this, you already know I agree with you on it all anyway.

As for the traffic coming from the website, well I agree its a 1 in a 1000000 shot but not having the info reduces that by the 1, which could explain why nobody's ever come from the website to SMP.

More than that it projects the opinion that SpA simply doesn't give a fuck about SMP which can't help and at least this one is an easy fix, it will take in total 20 minutes to do if we do it slowly.

_________________
swedishnitro wrote:
I take it all back. FFFFFFUUUUUU cardboard!!!!!


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 11:00 
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Lord of Minecraft (2894)
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[SpA]cardboard wrote:
[SpA]Howard wrote:
@cardboard
The whole ethos of the server has to change. A better balance must be struck between having a self managing server were grief of any serious nature is impossible and a server where new guys feel like they have any power at all. The change of Spawn will help that (if anyone ever comes here, has the discussion and decides how that change will be done) but more is still needed. My changes to this server made it far, far easier for OPs as they no longer had to worry about new guys griefing (and this was the major complaint I got - that OPs never got to play the game, just manage it) but on the counter swing my changes made it so easy for OPs that they apparently had nothing left to do and left.
Not disputing this, you already know I agree with you on it all anyway.

As for the traffic coming from the website, well I agree its a 1 in a 1000000 shot but not having the info reduces that by the 1, which could explain why nobody's ever come from the website to SMP.

More than that it projects the opinion that SpA simply doesn't give a fuck about SMP which can't help and at least this one is an easy fix, it will take in total 20 minutes to do if we do it slowly.

Well I don't know how to do it. People cannot find the MC forums for looking it seems but the address is still posted there. As to the front page, I have no idea how to alter that and as to the wiki, I am told that we have been waiting for 8 months for you to reply and give us the logins as only you had them (this is what I am told but I figure I am in a permanent game of mushrooms around here). Several people have been put in charge of changing this - nothing ever happened.

_________________
"Fire rained from the sky on the day I was born: 10,000 lives I ended before drawing first breath. Do not speak to me of guilt or regret, Jonathan.” - Brayan, The Keepers of the Fire


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 11:54 
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Has no REAL life! (1620)
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[SpA]Howard wrote:
People cannot find the MC forums for looking it seems but the address is still posted there.
Server info in general chat, not an obvious place to put it. Maybe an announcement across the whole of the MC forums would be better?
[SpA]Howard wrote:
As to the front page, I have no idea how to alter that
I do; that's why I suggested some-one write it I'll add it.
[SpA]Howard wrote:
and as to the wiki, I am told that we have been waiting for 8 months for you to reply and give us the logins as only you had them (this is what I am told but I figure I am in a permanent game of mushrooms around here).
Well I was in hospital for much of that and on a lot of drugs when I got out. Now that you've reminded me I'll have a look. I'm not the only one with the logins, I didn't install it, or set it up and they aren't hard to switch out by a simple database edit, if it was urgent.

I'll have a look now.

_________________
swedishnitro wrote:
I take it all back. FFFFFFUUUUUU cardboard!!!!!


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 13 Jun 2012, 01:02 
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is Wonder Woman (5950)
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Just to add to that; as I have said in various places in here, we also have a Facebook page and twitter. I can also add news to the home page.

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us 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2012, 05:18 
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Hmm, maybe not Illiterate (20)
New players won't stay until you get rid of the separation between Bedlam and Hub, really.

Bedlam is basically a sanctioned griefing pit, with rampant theft, building destruction, and PKing. I dunno about you, but when I first joined the server it was a mess. There weren't any food animals or trees within a mile of the Bedlam spawns (Starter kit helps, but doesn't eliminate this problem) and mobs were everywhere. As soon as I tried to build a shelter from the mobs, some player with iron armor and a diamond sword pops in (Using Dynamap to stalk my location), kills me, takes my stuff, and lights everything (Chests, Crafting Bench, ect) on fire.

Then you're screwed. You can't get the Starter Kit again for 24 hours and you have no tools/food at all. The only way to stay safe in Bedlam is to run really far away from the spawn and hide your base somewhere. And honestly, if I was going to do that, I might as well play Single Player. The point of multiplayer, at least for me, is to play with people, not have to live in hiding from them.

And don't even get me started on the regulars who make it a habit to raid Bedlam frequently around 3 AM, when no one's awake to stop them...


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us 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2012, 16:25 
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Has learned to write! (152)
ok to what neo was saying i did see a poll that im wondering about earlier...i believe some of the issue with the pk'ing and the grief and stuff could be fixed if we actually implement that factions plugin that was in a poll...i mean it appears to be winning by far in the polls already. This will also make more of acommunity like neo was complaining about since you will most likely try to join a large faction, the only issue i can foresee with that is a large group decideing to target new players...this isnt my area of expertise on how to solve that though.

Also on the point of mobs in bedlam...i believe mobs are meant to be everywhere neo. I get part of ur complaint i mean the starter kit could probably use a stone sword or something to defend urself early on bu besides that mobs are just part of the game.


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us 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jul 2012, 04:50 
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Has no REAL life! (1700)
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Beforehand notice, this jumps all around. To tired to worry about fixing it properly.

As for the wiki, I was the original one requesting them. Not knowing your condition, I as anyone would figured it was just the standard "SpA Time" so I gave up. I'd be willing to do it still if I had the access, yet there is still talks about redoing our website. Not sure if I would want to make a wiki twice :P

The program that would be used allows an easy way to add the wiki that works in unison with our forum/website user accounts and allows us to expand the wiki for other games such as FB, tf2, etc. For tf2 we could add information such as the different class guides that were created, but that is venturing away from the original topic.

What we need, as I always stress, is structure(and I always use this in a broad way, because we lack it in many senses). Thinking SMP, all our new users are from outside sources. We have trouble getting our new users registered so its definitely not from our website :P. Easy accessible information for our 8 year old minecrafters is the perfect solution for website usage. The only way in our current website is as cardboard has suggested, the home page blog or stickied topics(but I doubt they would be found by our users.)

Advertisement is key as all of us are saying. I have even suggested some alternatives for advertising on websites and such. But as I expected, it got turned down, or maybe it didn't even reach the administration. What ever the reason may have been, I can fully understand, but advertising could never hurt.


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jul 2012, 09:36 
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Lord of Minecraft (2894)
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Adverts are needed and we wil get there but I am not about to advertise a server that is due to go through a drastic overhaul. We need all the many issues to be resolved and the server to be functioning before we bring in a host of new people.

_________________
"Fire rained from the sky on the day I was born: 10,000 lives I ended before drawing first breath. Do not speak to me of guilt or regret, Jonathan.” - Brayan, The Keepers of the Fire


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us 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 13 Jul 2012, 02:54 
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Has no REAL life! (1700)
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[SpA]Howard wrote:
Adverts are needed and we wil get there but I am not about to advertise a server that is due to go through a drastic overhaul. We need all the many issues to be resolved and the server to be functioning before we bring in a host of new people.
Agreed. :5:


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us 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2013, 17:02 
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Pretty useless (84)
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First of all, I would like to say that I am not a coder, not a mod maker, or anything similar to either of those. Therefore, I do not know how easy or complicated this might be to implement, or if it's even possible. But, if there is a way, we might have people (above a specified rank?) apply to run a small town/village of guests in a bedlam-like world. They could resolve most issues within the town, and there could be some kind of teleportation system taking them to different villages. (If possible, there could be some protection over the village to help deter grief.) There could be some easy registry system such-as clicking a sign to apply for (citizenship?) to the village...
Again, no clue if this is possible, but if so, I would be willing to do anything else to help. I love SMP and would hate to see it go. It is a great server.

_________________
If it isn't broken, then fix it until it is.


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at 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2013, 17:08 
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Geek (749)
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Nitron200 wrote:
First of all, I would like to say that I am not a coder, not a mod maker, or anything similar to either of those. Therefore, I do not know how easy or complicated this might be to implement, or if it's even possible. But, if there is a way, we might have people (above a specified rank?) apply to run a small town/village of guests in a bedlam-like world. They could resolve most issues within the town, and there could be some kind of teleportation system taking them to different villages. (If possible, there could be some protection over the village to help deter grief.) There could be some easy registry system such-as clicking a sign to apply for (citizenship?) to the village...
Again, no clue if this is possible, but if so, I would be willing to do anything else to help. I love SMP and would hate to see it go. It is a great server.
AKA: Towny


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gb 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 26 May 2013, 21:30 
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Crap at posting (59)
Hmm, if I understood it correctly what he wants is ONE big town, something like spawn city, but organized and not just as a lawn ornament.

You would come into the game and actually have a city you could participate in without the massive headache of rent/permissions/etc that towny has.

The problem with that would be people willing to actually put up with it. :D


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nl 
 Post subject: Re: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 26 May 2013, 22:23 
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Nerdish, tbh. (503)
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AndragonLea wrote:
Hmm, if I understood it correctly what he wants is ONE big town, something like spawn city, but organized and not just as a lawn ornament.

You would come into the game and actually have a city you could participate in without the massive headache of rent/permissions/etc that towny has.

The problem with that would be people willing to actually put up with it. :D
Towny has been disabled some time ago and SMP isn't all that dying anymore.


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_________________
+[[color=#0040BF]FrankyDoodle[/color]]) ah french most fucky and irritating language ever
(+SVB) ([color=#0040BF]opo89[/color]) french is good
(+SVB) ([color=#0040BF]DarkknightM45[/color]) all the french are good at is surrendering

[color=#0000FF]Freebuild[/color] [color=#FF0000]Operator[/color]
[color=#0000FF]SMP[/color] [color=#008000]Member[/color]


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us 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 27 May 2013, 20:31 
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Does Minecraft or something... (1323)
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Wait, we don't have towny anymore? Dang i need to come back and get with the program.

Anyways I am going to try to fix my computer and start livestream me playing on the server, if that's okay with staff...

_________________
Procrastination is like a credit card: it's a lot of fun until you get the bill.
-Christopher Parker


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fi 
 Post subject: Re: SMP is dying.
PostPosted: 01 Jun 2013, 17:05 
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Has no REAL life! (1690)
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awesomefriends56 wrote:
Wait, we don't have towny anymore? Dang i need to come back and get with the program.

Anyways I am going to try to fix my computer and start livestream me playing on the server, if that's okay with staff...
Towny was practically unused, so twas removed.
I don't see anything wrong with a stream.

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