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Overclocking
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Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 24 Dec 2007, 16:21 ]
Post subject:  Overclocking
While I'm overclocking the biatch, i'm getting some really high stressed temps.
So , i'm thinking about goin to watercool, does anyone have experience with WC systems?

I wanna start with cooling the cpu and the northbridge and soutbridge and in the near future my graph card and some further away, my ram as well.
Author:  Quattro [ 24 Dec 2007, 23:54 ]
Post subject: 
ive been reading about it in forums.
but wouldnt use it if i didnt have much experince.
its a high risk
Author:  [SpA]Geylani [ 26 Dec 2007, 05:23 ]
Post subject: 
Water cooling owns f. hard.
Some dude managed up to +2ghz
Read some forums :)
Author:  [SpA]th3-mute [ 26 Dec 2007, 11:51 ]
Post subject: 
Personally, I'm not a big fan...

First of all yer gonna go out and spend probably around £200 extra on your PC, to get no extra game performance until you OC yer graphics card. Right now with OR without ANY overclock, yer CPU is so much more powerful than the rest of your PC that there's NO point in real world performance; games, to doing this.

I've watercooled before and found it an extra source of noise. Found it made my PC heavier, bulkier and more fragile - And I like to LAN, so transporting a water cooled system isn't something I looked forward to... It also adds a couple hundred watts per hour onto your electricity bill. At this point I should let you see how that works...
- An average performance PC is running at 450-550watts. That's HALF the amount of an ELECTRIC fire (you know those ones with the heating BAR). If you stay in your own place, you'll understand how much money it costs to run just one of those fires for 12hours... Imagine that 7 days a week, and then add some more money to your bill to cover the watercooling. It's a lot over a year, believe me...

I also happen to know 2 guys who had "accidents". One with a liquid nitrogen cooled AthlonX2 and the other with a regular TT Watercooler. They both lost about £500 worth of components in their respective "leaks"...

My advice? Don't do it. You'll spend hundreds of pounds cooling your WHOLE system. You'll spend DAYS tweaking it to get it running smoothly, and after you've spend all that money and time - You COULD have just spent half the amount, bought a faster model of Graphics card and have the EXACT SAME result but you get to keep all those extra hours of infuriating tweaking/adjusting (praying it doesn't go wrong) to ACTUALLY ENJOY YOUR PC INSTEAD!!!
Author:  [SpA]Ruscher [ 26 Dec 2007, 12:51 ]
Post subject: 
My brother once overclocked his PC and the result was that his whole PC fucked hp because he had a too bad cooler.

I Agree with Mute on that, it's to risky.
Author:  Quattro [ 26 Dec 2007, 22:43 ]
Post subject: 
go for watercooling bucky! :P
make an electric water liquid monster plz! :D

pics when done
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 27 Dec 2007, 11:37 ]
Post subject: 
first of all, I don't care about the noize.
2nd of all, I am gonna OC my graph card, but do that a month later when i have money again.
The tweaking and adjusting seems fun to me, like a hobby, spending loads of money on your computer and pimp the shit out of it! :D
The noise wouldn't bother me either, it's noizy now anyway, I don't care, my music is always louder!
I just want those temps of the cpu down by a load! It's runnin above 65 degrees when I overclock to 3,3 ghz. I think even the cooler ain't right on cuz of the missing backplate and sucky suspension of it. When I feel my cooler now, when it says it's runnin on 65 degrees , i can touch the outermost plate of the cooler and I don't feel any heat, only a little bit near the cpu. Is this normal mute? Could you stress test your pc till it hits some higher temp then tell me if you feel heat?
But back on the topic, I just like the idea of the WC'ing my computer :D
I'm gonna build it outside of my case, my electric bill is too high anyway, I pay 162 euros a month for just a one person household where I'm away at leat a week a month being at work.
One thing I really don't like is the leaking bit. I've spend loads of money on all the stuff in it , I really don't have that money again if it goes wrong.
But tell me mute, If i do the stuff outside of my computer and I make sure it's mounted correctly in my computer, like having the hose on right and tight with hose "clams" (how'd you call them in uk?), what can go wrong with leaking?
If I can manage to do the plumbing of copper and lead in my house, why wouldn't I be able to make it so in my computer? Next to that, what about copper in ur computer? Man, that would rock!
So, if leaking would be the only danger I'd have?
Cuz i would do it even for the elec bill, money that the equipment costs,noise, tweaking, etc.
I wouldn't do it if it wouldn't drop temps way.
And about the oc'ing over the 25%, man, I want my windows to be fookin fast! :D
Gonna buy me 2 raptor discs and put em on RAID0 :D
Gonna pimp everything in that little box!

Oh mute, my computer is heavy now anyway, it weighs over the 10Kg! :D

Here the two posts, 1st about OC'ing, 2nd about WC'ing
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1250472

http://www.overclock.net/water-cooling/ ... ssues.html

and here the set somebody looked up for me to buy, some nice stuff !
Image
Author:  [SpA]Ruscher [ 27 Dec 2007, 13:13 ]
Post subject: 
a german site isnt it? :D
Author:  Quattro [ 27 Dec 2007, 16:24 ]
Post subject: 
holy fuck, stop writing those long posts, i cba to read :D
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 04 Jan 2008, 22:02 ]
Post subject: 
Bucky youve got mental temps cause a clip is loose! My heatsink slipped and I hit 80C and thought it was bullshtting me but obviously. checked the heatsink to find a clip broken and a 2nd coming loose. Check them!

~Bex
Author:  [SpA]th3-mute [ 05 Jan 2008, 12:23 ]
Post subject: 
^^ Yup, fix your clip you n00b :P Yer temps will drop a massive amount.

That's REALLY not inspiring confidence in you watercooling if you didn't realise that the damaged clip was a major heat problem... :S
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 05 Jan 2008, 14:18 ]
Post subject: 
:D
i bought a backplate for it, gonna mount it soon somewhere this month :D
But I'm still thinking about watercooling, just for the fun of it and hobbying ! :D
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 14 Jan 2008, 23:13 ]
Post subject: 
*face palm* IT'S CLIPS NOT A STUPID BACK PLATE!!!! Argh....

~Bex
Author:  Quattro [ 14 Jan 2008, 23:33 ]
Post subject: 
lol bucky
Author:  [SpA]th3-mute [ 15 Jan 2008, 09:29 ]
Post subject: 
I don't think I use a backplate on mine...? I think I remember taking it off :S
Author:  [SpA]demm [ 15 Jan 2008, 13:03 ]
Post subject: 
Hey.
I have my CPU watercooled using a ThermalTake Bigwater 735. http://www.thermaltake.com/product/Ligu ... -w0075.asp
It's a set of everything you need to get you started and it doesn't cost much.
I primarily didn't buy it for overclocking, but for the lower noise. So I overclocked my CPU only 600Mhz and have to say im pretty pleased with it. The noise is low and I'm running at 45°C under full load.
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 16 Jan 2008, 13:52 ]
Post subject: 
Those components aren't really the greatest choices.... You realise you'll get much much much much more performance and reusable high quality componenets in the Swiftech kit? NOT THAT YOU NEED IT!

There is no back plate for that heat sink... just borrow a clip off your old default heatsink and that'll fix it............................................... n00b :? :roll:

~Bex

PS. The bracket that comes with them is for K8 fittings.. I know the bracket is NOT for the 775 though! There's 2 seperate models so you don't misuse them to idiot proof it more!

"To make life easier, the Ultra-90 we have here comes pre-fitted with an LGA775 mounting bracket that fits on almost every socket LGA775 motherboard out in the market. The mounting bracket is identical to Intel's reference bracket, which utilizes push-pins to lockdown the heatsink onto the motherboard. Unfortunately, the Ultra-90 can only be installed on either socket LGA775 or K8. There's no way you can install an Ultra-90 LGA775 on a K8 (or vice-versa) simply because the mounting brackets are non-detachable. So basically, you will need to buy the Ultra-90 K8 if you were to install on socket 754, 939, 940 or even AM2 (it should fit on socket AM2). This is the only weak point we have seen so far but it could have been better if users could swap the mounting brackets. As you can see, the bracket is actually a separate piece from the heatsink base. When installing, the groove in the on top of the base helps to position the brackets correctly."

Image

Image

Rant Over! :lol:
Author:  [SpA]th3-mute [ 16 Jan 2008, 17:05 ]
Post subject: 
Thankyou lass :) Hopefully that'll sort him out!!!
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 16 Jan 2008, 17:10 ]
Post subject: 
i already have bought a backplate that'll fit my mobo and the cooler.
I just cba to get everything out of my case and back into it for just a backplate. My temps aren't getting over the 65 on 100% core loads, so I'll fix the backplate sometime when I'm bored!
Author:  [SpA]th3-mute [ 16 Jan 2008, 17:50 ]
Post subject: 
But read what she said - it doesn't USE a backplate on a 775 - If you're doing that, you've got it fitted wrong (as in you're using an AMD mechanism on an Intel setup!)...
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 16 Jan 2008, 17:59 ]
Post subject: 
dude, i'll go take pics for ya if you want,but as far as i have researched it is for the socket 775, at least it says so on the net.
I got the LGA775 Bolt thru kit, and it says on the box designed for thermalright CPU coolers on intel LGA775 platform. You say i can't get that on the cooler?
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 16 Jan 2008, 21:21 ]
Post subject: 
[SpA]Bucky wrote:
You say i can't get that on the cooler?
No, you can't n00b. Not without damaging it. I bought Mute's for hima nd ordered it especially. There's 2 editions when bought OEM brown box style with nothing other than the bare minimal. The reatail is the exact same so idiots (like some *cough*) DON'T fuck up their mobo, CPU or the heatsink!

Now I did double check this - the bolt through backplate is for the 120 edition so it can be adjusted for AM2 as there is no specific 1 for AM2 in that size. The 90 is clip only - no bracket is available. It is not interchangable... As I stated earlier:
[SpA]Elemental Dragon wrote:
Unfortunately, the Ultra-90 can only be installed on either socket LGA775 or K8. There's no way you can install an Ultra-90 LGA775 on a K8 (or vice-versa) simply because the mounting brackets are non-detachable.
~Bex

PS. Image

As you look closely, that is attached to the underside. Meaning you'd damage the contact.
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 16 Jan 2008, 21:41 ]
Post subject: 
I have a socket 775, you're talking it won't fit am2?
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 17 Jan 2008, 10:47 ]
Post subject: 
....*twitch* .....*twitch*

I'm saying.... THE MOUNTING BRACKET KIT IS FOR THE ULTRA 120 NOT 90 YOU DUMBASS! IT DOESN'T WORK ON THE 90 AS THE BRACKETS ARE NON REMOVABLE! SO HOW THE FUCK ARE YOU GOING TO CHANGE THE TOP PIECE FOR YOUR NEW 775 FITTINGS AND BACKPLATE!? *refer to picture and bold text*

The AMD version of Ultra 90 has a plate because the standard fittings don't work. This backplate can be used on the Ultra 120 as there's only 1 model of 120 unlike the 90. Even at that - this back plate comes prefitted so you don't need to assemble it on teh 90 edition to keep it uninterchangable!

http://www.specialtech.co.uk/spshop/cus ... at=0&page=

Gah! Fuck it! Go break it and then Mute can laugh at you! I'm going back to concentrating on my watercooling project so I can overclock it faster than his.

~Bex
Author:  [SpA]SaintK [ 17 Jan 2008, 10:53 ]
Post subject: 
Can we cut the 'noob' comments and 'dumbass' comments and such? Please stay a bit civelised, thanks.
Author:  [SpA]th3-mute [ 17 Jan 2008, 11:08 ]
Post subject: 
Girls and Shandy.... *cough* :D

What she means is that the backplate version is only for the AMD cpu's - The INTEL 775 uses the four little plastic clips, spring, twist thingys, and with those you REALLY shouldnt use a back plate.
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 17 Jan 2008, 11:31 ]
Post subject: 
Firstly - Sorry Saint but he wouldn't listen - blame Mute for the encouragement :(
[SpA]th3-mute wrote:
What she means is that the backplate version is only for the AMD cpu's - The INTEL 775 uses the four little plastic clips, spring, twist thingys, and with those you REALLY shouldnt use a back plate.
Unless you have the 120 edition which has brackets for 775 and AM2

Image

This is the only 1 that comes with a bolt through kit for 775. The ultra 90 has a plate on top that is prefitted and uses clips only. That is why whn you buy them you specify which model you want as (at least in the brown box editions) it's 1 or the other - nothing else. But I've just check online and it seems to still be the same from when I last bought this.

HOWEVER I think I've foudn what you've found - Intel Bolt through - However, reading from other sites, although it says 90 edition, most then point out it's actually designed for the Ultra 120 not 90. That's from Tekheads, SpecialTech, and KPC (where I got Mute's and he's a biggy in the industry so I trust his knowledge like I trust Mutes - VERY WELL).

So although there's a possibility that it'll work, be very very careful with the measurements when changing it over as I still don't see how that's going to fit through the gap in teh centre above the contact without damage or warping. Although I still say your quicker just changing the clips. Plus if you over tighten you'll cause crush and warp damage. Just right and it'll give a perfect contact.

See? Even after all that I can still end on a positive cause I looked around for help for you Bucky - even if you don't ever seem to listen to it or Mutes :P

~Bex
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 17 Jan 2008, 13:00 ]
Post subject: 
I do listen, that's the point in asking advice, and that advice I take into my judgement of what to do.
The talk about the backplate came up when I already ordered them, so I have two backplates now lying around.
One for pim, who ordered the 120 and got a backplate with it, so that'll be useless, I'll take it to largs and pass it on to you mute, maybe you'll ever get an order for it, maybe not, more use with you then with me.
But as far as I could read on the net it would fit, so I ordered it.
I didn't get spare plugs with it, can you order them also from the net? Cuz I haven't found em here in the neighbourhood, didn't look that hard either.
So, what I'm gonna do, as the temps aren't getting that high that my chip can't stand it anymore, I'll let it like this and just wait till I get energy and enthousiasm and go check out if Bex's and Mute's saying are right and it does idd not fit, as I have two backplates laying around and it'll be a total waste if I don't even try.

As far as the HDs,Bex, you have two spinpoints in raid0 right? Could you do me a favour and run HDtune and post yer screenie here? I'm very curious at wat your getting, I'll post pim's screenie here with his raptors in raid0, so that'll give me the best comparison.
I still think that if the raptors have a much higher throughput I'd go for the slightly better disc, even if the spinpoints load games faster. Next to that, they have a much lower response time, which would give me great benefit in loading windows and running windows, as that respons time would benefit the most from accessing a lot of tiny small files, which loading windows and working in windows a little less does! (correct me if I'm wrong)
2xraptor = 240 euros
2xspinpoints = 180 euros
the difference is 60 euros, which is not that much if your planning on spending 180 at minimum anyway.
But, if the spinpoints get a same throughput result or slightly better or worse then the raptors, I'd might considder going for the spinpoints as I'm really low in cash the upcoming months.

P.S. I bought the thermalright ultra 90 on mute's advice, next to that I took a lot of his advice, got myself an nvidia 8800 gts , mute's advice made me make the final decision, got the mem on his advice, that doesn't mean I'd go automatically for everything he says. I want to find out stuff too and make changes here and there on principles. For example, saint just doesn't want nvidia cards so the idiot bought an ati! :lol: Got some things left I just wanna find out. Like watercooling, it looks like a fun hobby and it costs way too much money to get a good kit going! :D Sounds like a hobby to me! :D
As you seem to have an interest and knowledge on the quality of the WC set I composed, check this out
I have come up with this list
Image
That's almost the final list of stuff I would going to buy
Some changes in tubing is required to fit the valves and such.
If you'd like, here's the whole post about it:
http://www.overclock.net/water-cooling/ ... ues-4.html
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 17 Jan 2008, 13:06 ]
Post subject: 
this is what i've found on the net:

spinpoint 500 gb in raid0
Image

raptor 74gb in raid0 in pim's computer
Image

this is my WD
Image

saint's HD
Image
Author:  Elemental Dragon [ 17 Jan 2008, 14:57 ]
Post subject: 
Get this - Swiftech H20-220 Ultra This is the kit I have, the kit that should get me to 4ghz on my E6750.

- The block (Apogee GT) is 1 of the msot optimised for Core 2 Duos and the pump is like 2nd best on the market (it's a Laing pump - 1200LPH/1500LPH - same as the branded version).

- 1/2" piping to get maximum water around from the pump (type of piping isn't reallyt oo important)

- EK block is a good choice for your GPU - it's probably what I'll be getting if not a Danger Den

- clips, grills fans etc all come with the kit - though you'll want to invest in a few more or even jubilee clips)

- add a larger reservoir - eg. the XSPC bay (what I just purchased) and a bottle of Feser 1 coolant (best coolant on the market to be honest)

- as for the NB I'm not sure as I use the pre-fitted block. The DD 1s are meant to be very good or even the Swiftech M60 but most won't need to cool their NB.

However - I would suggest you maybe look at 1 of the compact WC kits from swiftech - they keep heavilly OC'd quads below 50c! Best bet if you just wanna start out without the hastle of assembling a kit. Swiftech is a very very very good name to go with. Cheap yet powerful. I'm having talk about it at the moment on Custom PC with a few others. That kit though will last a long time and most of the components can be reused.

~Bex
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