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| Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) https://forum.specialattack.net/viewtopic.php?t=3110 |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 09 Jul 2008, 18:24 ] |
| Post subject: | Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Well - from what I've seen most people seem to be using multicore processors but I wonder how many have heard of the infamous "mat_queue_mode" variable in TF2 (and all newer Source-based games). Usually TF2 only does particle calculations on the second (or any other ^^) core, so there's really not much improvement over single-core machines although that makes the performance more CPU-dependent than in many other games. However, by setting: mat_queue_mode "2" in your config file (create an autoexec.cfg text file in your steamapps -> your@account -> team fortress 2 -> tf -> cfg folder if you haven't one already) you can force TF2 to load some more stuff onto your other cores. Keep in mind that this feature is VERY unstable and may cause various problems and crashes. To avoid them you can do some further tweaks and testing with the following variables: host_thread_mode "1" This is only useful if you're both the host and client on the same machine but there's no reason to NOT use it and for some strange reason people have reported mat_queue_mode "2" to be working better with this turned on. These are the DEFAULT settings for the variables unless defined otherwise. As you can see only the particles are loaded into the second core. You should try using mat_queue_mode "2" with this default config first to check if it's stable at all. Then you can enable further features. cl_threaded_bone_setup "0" cl_interp_threadmodeticks "0" cl_threaded_client_leaf_system "0" r_threaded_client_shadow_manager "0" r_threaded_particles "1" r_threaded_renderables "0" r_queued_decals "0" r_queued_post_processing "0" The next two variables are CRUCIAL for making the whole "experiment" work. These AREN'T the default values for them - in fact they turn them OFF. HL2 automatically enables them if it thinks that your computer can handle them with mat_queue_mode "2" but in most cases it shouldn't since THEY are responsible for most crashes. Truth be told I couldn't get mat_queue_mode "2" to run in a stable manner with them set to anything other than "-1" but your mileage might vary... mp_usehwmmodels "-1" mp_usehwmvcds "-1" Now comes the fun part. I boldly enabled most of the features in my config and while some people reported an FPS increase of perhaps 20-30 or in some cases even an FPS DROP, I got an FPS increase of, I don't know almost a 100 (!) FPS on my overclocked Core2Duo E6600... 0_o The problem here is that I've been getting ~300 FPS in simpler, closed areas, which is the most the Source Engine can handle but of course my monitor is running at 75 Hz and hence can show only 75 FPS and that lead to some INCREDIBLE choppiness and screen tearing (yes, kids - that's why you should ALWAYS have VSYNC enabled unless your average FPS are close to your monitor refresh rate or you're running some benchmarks). The solution for this WOULD have been enabling VSYNC, which I have always enabled to limit my FPS to the refresh rate anyway since disabling it is friggin' moronic and usually only means that you don't know what it actually does BUT on my setup mat_queue_mode "2" kinda b0rked it - the FPS were jumping wildly between 75 and like 300 and this caused an incredible jitter... Turning VSYNC off wasn't a solution either, because then I had the usual share of problems, too, as I outlined above... Then it dawned on me that there's one good ol'e variable I completely forgot about: fps_max 75 (or simply your refresh rate in 3D mode and the given resolution) This allowed me to limits the FPS by hand to a handy-dandy 75 which is the most my monitor can display anyway and it even made VSYNC work correctly because the FPS didn't get the chance to "jump around"! Now my FPS are stuck at 75 no matter what even on my modest over 1-year-old rig and they used to decrease to around 50-60, perhaps even 40, in larger areas and heavy fights (I'm running maximum settings for everything, reflections FSAA etc.)... This is friggin' sweet! Now - as a final note I'll post my current config in autoexec.cfg - you might need to tweak it to your needs, it might not work on your machine at all or dramatically DECREASE performance - also, HL2 can crash frequently, so YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. However, it might actually work as smoothly as in my case and then you're in for one awesome gaming experience, especially if you were forced to use lower quality settings or had low FPS until now (remember that this requires AT LEAST a dual-core machine!) Code: mat_vsync "1" Again - unless it causes some major problems you should ALWAYS have it enabled... |
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| Author: | [SpA]TheWeirdo [ 09 Jul 2008, 18:51 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
I have read all your stuff too, and im on an intel dual core aswell. I'm really interested in doing this. I've read your whole post, but all i have to do is, copy the code:box into an empty autoexec.cfg? Not step-by-step? |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 09 Jul 2008, 19:05 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
You COULD try doing that but that could also lead to some stability issues and you'd have no idea why. =) I also don't know what refresh rate your monitor has and this affects the fps_max setting (should you need it at all - perhaps VSYNC would work just fine in your case)... Also - the autoexec.cfg needn't be empty if you already have one - just append the settings at the end of the file. My recommendation for the first test would be something like this: Code: If the framerate jumps around or if your graphics feel choppy try adding "fps_max" with the proper refresh rate as well. Some people claim to achieve a good stability to FPS boost ratio with only enabling "r_threaded_renderables" besides the particles... Again - this feature has been introduced in HL2: Episode 2 and is, as of today, still meant mostly for test purposes, so approach it with caution. =) |
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| Author: | [SpA]Noxious [ 09 Jul 2008, 19:16 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
I have tried mat_queue_mode "2" some time ago, but tf2 crashed after 10secs  I'll try to combine it with the other commands you posted and see if that works. Can you explain which commands affect image quality? For example I think mp_usehwmmodels and mp_usehwmvcds are for better quality and I have set them to "1" I guess is r_queued_post_processing is about post processing and it should be enabled too. |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 09 Jul 2008, 19:28 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
None of them affect image quality because they simply control which device is doing the work except for the mp_usehwmmodels mp_usehwmvcds variables. Not all hardware is compatible with them and setting it to "1" actually makes HL2 control them, not automatically enable them, AFAIK... r_queued_post_processing caused a plethora of graphical errors and I had to turn it off. |
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| Author: | [SpA]demm [ 09 Jul 2008, 19:31 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
I tried those commands before and all they did was crash my TF2. I couldn't find a stable setting. Valve should really fix this! They have better multi-core support in Ep2 and Portal. |
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| Author: | [SpA]Noxious [ 09 Jul 2008, 20:23 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
After 15mins it crashed... I saw that tf2 was consuming 1GB of memory before I close it  I don't think that it needs so much memory the other times. I think it's about 400-500MB 
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 09 Jul 2008, 20:44 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Well - it doesn't matter how much memory it uses if it's not more than you have. ^^ After all you're not gaining anything by having memory sitting around idly... |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 10 Jul 2008, 01:40 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
OK - as to the mp_usehwmmodels mp_usehwmvcds variables. They seem to do pretty much nothing unlike some STANDARD source variables used for graphics tweaking. =) I made some screenshots of the Sniper - unprofessionally, I admit, because I should have taken them exactly in the same moment (e.g. by writing a screenshot script) but it doesn't matter. Some were made with mp_usehwmmodels and mp_usehwmvcds enabled, some were made with both variables set to 0. I don't know which are which myself - would you be able to guess just by looking?       Note that I saved the images as lossless PNGs... However, try setting mat_picmip to -3 instead of the default 0 for high and be stunned by the incredible improvement... Of course I'm able to run the higher quality textures with reasonable FPS only with threaded support... HL2 crashed only ONCE with the settings I use and that's more than acceptable for me. If it crashes in your case then set mp_usehwmmodels and mp_usehwmvcds to -1 and disable e.g. the queued postprocessing. If you enable the so-called ultra-high models then HL2 will automatically crash in threaded mode... |
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| Author: | [SpA]Noxious [ 10 Jul 2008, 12:17 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote: However, try setting mat_picmip to -3 instead of the default 0 for high and be stunned by the incredible improvement... Of course I'm able to run the higher quality textures with reasonable FPS only with threaded support... Try setting it to "-10" which is for max quality  You can find more "quality" commands here |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 10 Jul 2008, 13:46 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
There's almost no visual difference between picmip -10 and picmip -3 except for lowering your FPS quite a lot. =) I did some comparisons yesterday - might post some screenshots later. |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 11 Jul 2008, 18:29 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
OK - I have around 3 days of extensive testing behind me and found out that the safest configuration, that is this one: Code: |
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| Author: | Beserker [ 12 Jul 2008, 21:16 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
It's a really buggy command, it doesn't work for some people and it's only serving as a replacement until the better dual core support comes out. |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 12 Jul 2008, 21:28 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
 [SpA]Lim-Dul wrote: Keep in mind that this feature is VERY unstable and may cause various problems and crashes.
-.-[...] some people reported an FPS increase of perhaps 20-30 or in some cases even an FPS DROP [...] it might not work on your machine at all or dramatically DECREASE performance - also, HL2 can crash frequently, so YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. [...] Again - this feature has been introduced in HL2: Episode 2 and is, as of today, still meant mostly for test purposes, so approach it with caution. =) [...] The other variables are strange. No matter which ones you enable or disable, sooner or later HL2 will crash in the least expected moment. Also, there seems to be no rule to this behavior - sometimes it worked fine for hours and then crashed for reasons unknown. =) (and some more I didn't bother to quote) Where you're wrong, however, is that this serves only as some kind of replacement. This is only a variable, a setting. It won't be replaced by anything but the mechanisms it enables (ergo: dual-core support) will be most likely improved although not before Ep. 3, I guess, even if Valve released one fix already because otherwise HL2 was crashing on each map change. ;-) |
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| Author: | jinja_ninja [ 16 Jul 2008, 11:55 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Save yourself the headache of unstable configs and buy a better graphics card! |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 16 Jul 2008, 15:56 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Well - I buy graphics cards every two years OR if I see that there really is a HUGE improvement over the last generation. E.g. GF9 and GF pseudo-10 aren't currently worth it for me... |
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| Author: | jinja_ninja [ 16 Jul 2008, 16:49 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote: Well - I buy graphics cards every two years OR if I see that there really is a HUGE improvement over the last generation. E.g. GF9 and GF pseudo-10 aren't currently worth it for me...
ATI have definately pulled the rabbit out of the hat this time. The 4870 series is fantastic.
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 16 Jul 2008, 16:53 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Not fantastic enough for me. ;-) When I upgraded from my GF6 to my current GF8 I had like a 100% performance improvement - that's what I call buy-worthy performance. ^^ On another note: talking about video cards is beside the point. Valve apparently CAN utilize the CPU power to make their games run MUCH faster, it just needs to improve it. Parallel programming is quite difficult, keeping all the threads synchronized and all, hence the options are unstable now. =) |
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| Author: | jinja_ninja [ 16 Jul 2008, 17:57 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote: Not fantastic enough for me.
Well if you currently have a good 8-series card, then I wouldn't worry about upgrading. Which 8-series card do you have btw?
 When I upgraded from my GF6 to my current GF8 I had like a 100% performance improvement - that's what I call buy-worthy performance. ^^ On another note: talking about video cards is beside the point. Valve apparently CAN utilize the CPU power to make their games run MUCH faster, it just needs to improve it. Parallel programming is quite difficult, keeping all the threads synchronized and all, hence the options are unstable now. =) |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 16 Jul 2008, 18:08 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
GeForce 8800 GTX 768 MB - more than enough to run TF2 smoothly which is all I care about right now... ^^ |
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| Author: | jinja_ninja [ 17 Jul 2008, 00:55 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote: GeForce 8800 GTX 768 MB - more than enough to run TF2 smoothly which is all I care about right now... ^^
Ah, in that case... I rest my case!8800GTX is still a great card. Stick with it until the next generation. |
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| Author: | [SpA]NabNab [ 17 Jul 2008, 15:12 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Dose this also work on quad core systems? |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 17 Jul 2008, 15:56 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Yep. |
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| Author: | [SpA]Blackhawk [ 17 Jul 2008, 16:20 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
I had a bunch of these settings and a bit of the "HQ" stuff running, but TF2 started to crash more and more this week. Most of the time on the mapchange screen (loading stuff from server) and once just from the middle of the game. This is very annoying if you then have to wait in the queue again. :/ Have you encountered similar situations while playing with the settings, Lim-Dul? Crash on maploading? Otherwise I have to search in a different direction. For now I have removed all non-standard-stuff from my config. |
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| Author: | Lim-Dul [ 17 Jul 2008, 17:01 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Yup, I have experienced crashes during map-changes. I use the safest config possible... People are saying that recent Source Engine updates made this function less stable than it used to be. Well - it's performance or stability, I guess. ^^ |
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| Author: | [SpA]Blackhawk [ 17 Jul 2008, 18:13 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
Ok... since I've got enough performance, I'll go for stability now.
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| Author: | DrMcMoist [ 17 Jul 2008, 20:13 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Improve FPS on multicore systems (or totally ruin them ;-) |
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote: Yup, I have experienced crashes during map-changes. I use the safest config possible... People are saying that recent Source Engine updates made this function less stable than it used to be. Well - it's performance or stability, I guess. ^^
I'd like to run it around 902 fps. How stable do you think this will be?
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