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What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
https://forum.specialattack.net/viewtopic.php?t=3190		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Beserker [ 21 Jul 2008, 16:00 ]
Post subject:  What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I'd say engineer, there will be a lot of clueless heavies about and unless some manage to get close with a medic it's easy pickings when you have a sentry and a dispenser.
Author:  [SpA]Baal Kagan [ 21 Jul 2008, 16:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
dude...u rly are bored, huh? :shock:
Author:  [SpA]futari [ 21 Jul 2008, 16:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I say we all go medic and not heal heavies :D
That'll get them back to not playing it~
Author:  [SpA]YellowGoudvis [ 21 Jul 2008, 16:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I totally agree with that, or maybe a scout
Author:  Lim-Dul [ 21 Jul 2008, 16:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I'd say an undisguised and uncloaked Spy coming frontally at the Heavy while he is spun up.

Do not forget the obligatory "Leeeeeeroy Jenkins!" battle-cry. ^^
Author:  Crovax20 [ 21 Jul 2008, 16:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I'm going spy probably, or engi.

Still sucks man, all these people who are clueless on how to play the heavy will be playing it. I just hope Valve doesn't pull another pyro wtfpwnbbq update out of their hat
Author:  staberas [ 21 Jul 2008, 19:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
i'm going Spy , Pyro with bb or demo 8)
Author:  DoubleJ [ 21 Jul 2008, 20:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I rather just be a Heavy to.... the one who returns 100% crits...
Author:  Lim-Dul [ 21 Jul 2008, 20:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Quote:
Pyro with bb
BB Gun? I don't think that will be effective. :-P
Author:  [SpA]SaintK [ 21 Jul 2008, 20:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Scout with a bat.
Author:  [SpA]Unity [ 21 Jul 2008, 21:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
just gonna play heavy, like i always do :D
Author:  DoubleJ [ 21 Jul 2008, 21:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
scout should get the 'exteavier'...

A bit whcih does instant kills on heavies.

But seeing that heavy will come.... /me looks at the making bacon achievement he still needs to earn...
Author:  [SpA]Blackhawk [ 21 Jul 2008, 22:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]futari wrote:
I say we all go medic and not heal heavies :D
That'll get them back to not playing it~
Yeah! Let's team up... I still need the "Consultation" achievement... :D
Author:  bOse [ 22 Jul 2008, 01:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
definately spy
Author:  2000AD [ 22 Jul 2008, 10:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]futari wrote:
I say we all go medic and not heal heavies :D
That'll get them back to not playing it~
I tried that with the pyro update but I got pretty much the entire server bar the heavy I was healing really pissed off at me.

I'd say a combination of sniper and spy. Spy for the reasons mentioned, sniper because heavies are the easiest to headshot, just wait the few seconds for full charge, take aim at the big bald dome and then boom. On maps like Dustbowl and Gold rush snipers own any heavy that isn't uber-charged.
Author:  katonczyk [ 22 Jul 2008, 10:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Sniper. It's just too easy picking heavies at the distance. :)
Author:  [SpA]Nutty82uk [ 22 Jul 2008, 11:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Sniper....and watch all those big bad boys fall :lol:
Author:  [SpA]MRuler [ 22 Jul 2008, 11:37 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]Nutty82uk wrote:
Sniper....and watch all those big bad boys fall :lol:
sniper &nd spy if there are actually decent heavies! otherwise just use a demoman and what your stickies explode ...
Author:  [SpA]Bucky [ 22 Jul 2008, 11:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
sniper and spy idd, or you could try some pyro ambushing and try to sneak up behind them or have a couple of pyros distract them while the other pyro runs around them, you only need 2 pyros on 1 heavy and the pyros should go in opposite directions around the heavy.
Otherwise you could try to lure the heavies around a corner where a demoman is waiting for them with a shit load of stickies.
But the main thing we have to trust on is the class limitter with a restriction of 4 heavies normally. I say we tune it down a bit to 3 when the update has come out making it so that when everyone wants to go heavy and normally you would be allowed to have 4 in one team, now it makes it even less possible to be heavy.
Next to that, 3 heavies in one team is more then enough.
Author:  Crovax20 [ 22 Jul 2008, 12:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]MRuler wrote:
[SpA]Nutty82uk wrote:
Sniper....and watch all those big bad boys fall :lol:
sniper &nd spy if there are actually decent heavies! otherwise just use a demoman and what your stickies explode ...
Demoman stickies will probably be nerfed when the update hits. And good riddance, fucking overpowered things. Seriously, Insane damage, Insane blast radius and zero to non delay on them. The amounts of time I played a 125 hp class and got instagibbed by one sticky are too many to count, the demoman needs to just aim in the general direction and press his I win button.

Only chance you got is if you are just as fast or faster than him and can follow him at point blank. Else you might as well retreat and wait for another chance.

And don't even get me started about crit stickies insta killing heavies.
Author:  jinja_ninja [ 22 Jul 2008, 14:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]Crovax20 wrote:
[SpA]MRuler wrote:
[SpA]Nutty82uk wrote:
Sniper....and watch all those big bad boys fall :lol:
sniper &nd spy if there are actually decent heavies! otherwise just use a demoman and what your stickies explode ...
Demoman stickies will probably be nerfed when the update hits. And good riddance, fucking overpowered things. Seriously, Insane damage, Insane blast radius and zero to non delay on them. The amounts of time I played a 125 hp class and got instagibbed by one sticky are too many to count, the demoman needs to just aim in the general direction and press his I win button.

Only chance you got is if you are just as fast or faster than him and can follow him at point blank. Else you might as well retreat and wait for another chance.

And don't even get me started about crit stickies insta killing heavies.
I agree.

Stickies get on my nerves a LOT.

The annoying this is when you have a camping Demoman who just places stickies and waits until someone walks past. Rinse and Repeat.
Author:  Lim-Dul [ 22 Jul 2008, 15:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Quote:
The annoying this is when you have a camping Demoman who just places stickies and waits until someone walks past. Rinse and Repeat.
Well - THIS surely won't be changed since that's what stickies are meant to do - hence the Demoman is labeled as a defensive class. What stickies AREN'T meant to do, IMHO, is being used as rockets and 3 of them shot in like 2 seconds in the targets general vicinity killing a gazillion of buildings some engies have been setting up for the last couple of minutes... Oh, and you have 8 of them in your clip... =)

It's not that I'm NOT a Demoman player (I'm an all-class player, remember) but actually each time I come across some serious trouble with any other class, e.g. sentries, heavies, camping people, people rushing one way or my kills-per-death getting too low I switch to the Demoman and watch my score miraculously increase... Ah, the Soldier is being advertised as having teh ub0r rocketjump... Well - Demomen have their STILL ridiculous nade-jump that catapults them across like half the map - I mean, WTF?

I'm not saying that Demomen don't require skill to harness their power but once you learn certain tricks etc. they are really borderline broken, IMHO. I don't know who suggested that but I think the idea of sticky bombs having to charge up a bit to reach full power is really the best one - this would give e.g. engineers a chance to defend themselves with shooting the stickies away while noobs would still be totally owned.
Author:  DrMcMoist [ 22 Jul 2008, 15:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Yeah the Demoman nade jump is pretty insane. I was healing either Saint K or Magisk on Goldrush one day and we were defending. So we were heading down toward the Blu spawn for the start of the match, and whoever it was does this massive nade jump quite literally from the first checkpoint down to the spawn. My reaction was actually "Jesus Christ!"

I do hate the Demoman though. I just think it's cheap as hell getting blown up by some camping Demoman. I realise this is what his class was designed for and I came to terms with that a long time ago but even still, the stickies are overpowered and I hate them.
Author:  [SpA]Noxious [ 22 Jul 2008, 15:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
I will play heavy :4


Concerning the demoman now... The sticky jump was bugged when they adjusted soldier's self damage and with 1 sticky you could fly veeery far. Now it's fixed. Moreover demoman takes more damage to do a sticky jump than a soldier so it's fair that he can travel further.
I'm getting a bit sad that valve will ruin the demoman at the next update :(
Author:  Lim-Dul [ 22 Jul 2008, 15:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Quote:
Now it's fixed.
Yeah, right. Because flying e.g. from the just around the corner before the last checkpoint on pl_goldrush stage 3 all the way up to the balcony next to the defending team's spawn is perfectly normal (Magisk is doing that all the time so I got used to it :-P)... On gravelpit point B you can catapult yourself so far with just ONE sticky placed on the spawn exit that you might actually OVERSHOOT the roof. What about flying from one base to another on 2fort - c'mon - let him take less damage then but don't make him fly around as if he had a jetpack...
Author:  DoubleJ [ 22 Jul 2008, 22:20 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]Bucky wrote:
sniper and spy idd, or you could try some pyro ambushing and try to sneak up behind them or have a couple of pyros distract them while the other pyro runs around them, you only need 2 pyros on 1 heavy and the pyros should go in opposite directions around the heavy.
Otherwise you could try to lure the heavies around a corner where a demoman is waiting for them with a shit load of stickies.
But the main thing we have to trust on is the class limitter with a restriction of 4 heavies normally. I say we tune it down a bit to 3 when the update has come out making it so that when everyone wants to go heavy and normally you would be allowed to have 4 in one team, now it makes it even less possible to be heavy.
Next to that, 3 heavies in one team is more then enough.
I think you should just stick with 4 and not bring it down to 3 at all. Got the same thing with pyro last, in a round where an additional pyro would be handy, noone could go into 1. 4 of each class should be a limit and you should not put it down to 3.
Author:  [SpA]Blackhawk [ 22 Jul 2008, 22:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote:
Yeah, right. Because flying e.g. from the just around the corner before the last checkpoint on pl_goldrush stage 3 all the way up to the balcony next to the defending team's spawn is perfectly normal (Magisk is doing that all the time so I got used to it :-P)... On gravelpit point B you can catapult yourself so far with just ONE sticky placed on the spawn exit that you might actually OVERSHOOT the roof. What about flying from one base to another on 2fort - c'mon - let him take less damage then but don't make him fly around as if he had a jetpack...
Image
Author:  Magisk [ 22 Jul 2008, 22:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
[SpA]Lim-Dul wrote:
On gravelpit point B you can catapult yourself so far with just ONE sticky placed on the spawn exit that you might actually OVERSHOOT the roof. What about flying from one base to another on 2fort - c'mon - let him take less damage then but don't make him fly around as if he had a jetpack...
This is unfortunately not true anymore afaik :( Damn nerfs
Author:  Crovax20 [ 22 Jul 2008, 23:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
Demoman deserves to be nerfed into oblivion. Its pathetic really, all the top players on the server use the demoman to up their score. I have been on a crusade against demoman ever since I got the game.

I mean, I kill them by the dozens but nothing is more cheesy than seeing a crit sticky flying towards you and knowing you are dead no matter what class you are. Or a normal sticky if you have 125 health.... My usual approach to killing demoman is try and get them offgaurd and wtfpwn them with my scout/spy. If they notice me and start firing stickies I just pull back and forget about it all together. Hell when I'm playing Heavy and have a medic I only really have to pull back when a demoman comes and fires sticky nades all over the place or there are a gazillion bullets,rockets etc flying towards me. Stickies are just too powerfull as an offensive weapon.

And yes, I take great pleasure into batting demoman to death, because thats the only range the sticky n00bs can't hurt you POINT BLANK. Better hope they don't have any skill in aiming the normal nades else you get instapopped as a scout anyhow.
Author:  katonczyk [ 24 Jul 2008, 10:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: What class should we use to counter the Heavy update?
wow what a hostility. I love demoman. Its great both in offence and defence. About crit stickies - what about crit rockets? Same thing. And now, with hot air baloon blast from regular pyro gun demo is not that overpowered.
Flying around isn't that much fun as you eventually end up on enemy territory, with half your normal health (take 2fort). And dont forget that against faster classes in 1vs1 duels demo has a big problem unless you're skilled enough to hit you opponent with a granade. And it has to be a direct hit! Sometimes it's just easier to rush with your bottle in that cases ^^
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